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#101 2014-12-02 11:48:53

FelipeCarvalho
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin, tell me, what is the main cause of problems of that area of pitch you mention? The E4-A4 area?

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2014-12-02 11:48:53

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#102 2014-12-02 13:09:42

geno
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin H wrote:

@Daniel

I don't see any problems in using the "ah" vowel throughout the range without modifying? The only thing to be aware of is not using too much volume. So I still don't understand why you and others mention those specific "bridging" areas?

Regarding this - A common approach (and I studied with several classical / operatic teachers when I was Owen's age) is to start the formant shift on Ah around E4 (modifying to Aw or Uh).  At that time I was singing loudly in the high range.  For some reason the teachers weren't trying to teach me to sing soft - they tried to help me navigate the passagio with my louder singing.

I remember a fellow student who already had a developed high range - but he sang with a much lower volume so he didn't worry about modifying.  Our teacher (who was an excellent operatic tenor) was trying to get my friend to sing with more power / adduction - so his issues were different than mine.

One thing to remember is these operatic teachers are teaching non-mic'd, powerful singing, so Vowel Modification is important to learn.

Thanks to this forum I've learned to sing lightly in the high range. And where I used to think Modifying was always necessary, it is not.

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#103 2014-12-02 14:57:02

Martin H
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Felipe

In my opinion then main problem is learning to coordinate the laryngeal muscles properly in M1 and to avoid constriction. Males are normally not used to this range since their average speaking pitch is around 110 Hz.

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#104 2014-12-02 14:59:38

Robert Lunte
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Martin.... Yes.  When I work on it, sometimes I slow down the articulation of the text... just to keep it intact. Repeat it over and over and slow pick up the speed. Then sing it in the original tempo and feel.

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#105 2014-12-02 15:02:37

Martin H
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Geno

It's also important to be aware that vowel modification at the passaggio in classical singing is mainly a result of their sound ideal.

Last edited by Martin H (2014-12-02 15:05:35)

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#106 2014-12-02 15:04:48

FelipeCarvalho
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin indeed. And what kind of measures do we do to avoid constrictions?

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#107 2014-12-02 15:10:31

Martin H
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Felipe

Well, there can be many reasons why people constrict. But I would say it's crucial to not exceed the maximum volume for a given vowel.

Last edited by Martin H (2014-12-02 15:11:14)

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#108 2014-12-02 15:38:28

FelipeCarvalho
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

That's true. Also not protude the jaw, not clench the teeth, not lowering the tongue, and etc.

Things that I believe are important to keep in check right? At least when there is a problem to solve of course.

Would you say its important that the singer learns how it feels like when doing so?

If you consider that males often go above the itensity that would allow the use of all possible vowels, its not that hard to understand why mapping changes of sensations and some "default" modifications can be useful.

I do agree however that its important to remember that the changes are something we do (not a physical part of the voice), and that the sensations are not the cause of correct positioning, just a reference.

Last edited by FelipeCarvalho (2014-12-02 16:10:35)

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#109 2014-12-02 16:08:05

Robert Lunte
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

its not that hard to understand why mapping changes of sensations and some "default" modifications can be useful.

Bingo! Felipe, this is the reason why I have created vowel modification formulas in my program. It is an attempt to "map" the changes or lets say, "best practice" modification that can be useful. Not only for smooth bridging but also for resistance training. Not wanting it to become too complicated, I have selected 8 primary training vowels, that include three "acoustic mode" groups and consists of open and narrowed vowels. I assign each of these vowels a color... then with the "Pillars' training content, proceed to build vowel modification formulas or what you are referring to as "maps" for each of the vowels. Giving each vowel a unique color, enables me to illustrate the these formulas with color/visual gradients... like colors of a rainbow,... to make the point that they shade in and out of each other. Thus, the program has 12 of these key formulas in them, soon to have 13... perhaps Ill add more as time goes by.

I'm not trying to pitch my program here, just pointing out that I came to the same conclusion a while back and have build some training tools around that same idea.

Ill give Martin some credit here too. He was helpful in our private discussions in figuring out the nature of these vowels.

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#110 2014-12-02 16:31:28

Martin H
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Registered: 2008-11-25
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

FelipeCarvalho wrote:

Would you say its important that the singer learns how it feels like when doing so?

If you consider that males often go above the intensity that would allow the use of all possible vowels, its not that hard to understand why mapping changes of sensations and some "default" modifications can be useful.

I definitely agree that it's important that the singer learns to be aware of the differences. And vowel modifications are very important.

I just want to note, that in my opinion, the need for vowel modifications is not depended on specific areas in the voice ("bridges") - but instead it's highly depended on intensity.

Two quick examples in regards to the passaggio:

-You can sing an "ee" from Eb4-G4 without modifying if you keep the volume low/medium

-You can sing an "ih" from Eb4-G4 without modifying if you keep the volume medium/loud

Last edited by Martin H (2014-12-02 17:33:40)

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#111 2014-12-02 16:56:07

Robert Lunte
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Posts: 3087
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin H wrote:

FelipeCarvalho wrote:

Would you say its important that the singer learns how it feels like when doing so?

If you consider that males often go above the intensity that would allow the use of all possible vowels, its not that hard to understand why mapping changes of sensations and some "default" modifications can be useful.

I definitely agree that it's important that the singer learns to be aware of the differences. And vowel modifications are very important.

I just want to note, that in my opinion, the need for vowel modifications is not depended on specific areas in the voice ("bridges") - but instead it's highly depended on intensity.

Two quick examples in regards to the passaggio:

-You can sing an "ee" from Eb4-G4 without modifying if you keep the vowel low/medium

-You can sing an "ih" from Eb4-G4 without modifying if you keep the vowel medium/loud

Yes, and you can seen and "eh" & "a" (cat) all day long at full throttle... this is a really good point ! The intensity or volume... what would be the more scientific term for it Martin?

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#112 2014-12-02 17:16:45

MDEW
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Not meaning to bring any other program into things but isn't volume and vowel mods the whole point of Modes in
the C.V.T. terminology?


"Knock me down, It's all in vain. I'll get right back on my feet again."  Pat Benatar

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#113 2014-12-02 17:21:08

Martin H
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Registered: 2008-11-25
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Robert Lunte wrote:

Yes, and you can seen and "eh" & "a" (cat) all day long at full throttle... this is a really good point ! The intensity or volume... what would be the more scientific term for it Martin?

Exactly, you can use way more intensity on those vowels. It's based on something called the "acoustic overload" principle.

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#114 2014-12-02 17:23:10

Martin H
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Registered: 2008-11-25
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

MDEW wrote:

Not meaning to bring any other program into things but isn't volume and vowel mods the whole point of Modes in
the C.V.T. terminology?

Yes they are, and pitch.

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#115 2014-12-02 18:04:48

Martin H
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

I just did a quick audio example (including the "eh" vowel) in regards to :

Two quick examples in regards to the passaggio:

-You can sing an "ee" from Eb4-G4 without modifying if you keep the volume low/medium

-You can sing an "ih" from Eb4-G4 without modifying if you keep the volume medium/loud

https://app.box.com/s/v2ui7p76qimnzukvgszy

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#116 2014-12-02 18:11:49

Danielformica
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From: San Luis Obispo
Registered: 2011-08-10
Posts: 1552
Reputation :   62 
Website

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin H wrote:

FelipeCarvalho wrote:

Would you say its important that the singer learns how it feels like when doing so?

If you consider that males often go above the intensity that would allow the use of all possible vowels, its not that hard to understand why mapping changes of sensations and some "default" modifications can be useful.

I definitely agree that it's important that the singer learns to be aware of the differences. And vowel modifications are very important.

I just want to note, that in my opinion, the need for vowel modifications is not depended on specific areas in the voice ("bridges") - but instead it's highly depended on intensity.

Two quick examples in regards to the passaggio:

-You can sing an "ee" from Eb4-G4 without modifying if you keep the volume low/medium

-You can sing an "ih" from Eb4-G4 without modifying if you keep the volume medium/loud

"If you keep" is key here and when you come to specific "bridges" you need to do something. What you do is keep at a specific volume and vowel.  So that is what you do at a bridge. You can call it what you want I was taught to call it a bridge you were taught the "acoustic overload" and I like to teach "pitch vowel and intensity".

@Martin I didn't see you wrote this.


I don't use the normal concept of "bridging". I acknowledge that there are certain places in ones range that can be difficult to navigate. Also, the progressive narrowing of the vowels has nothing to do with the narrowing that happens at the lower pharyngeal levels in regards to higher pitches.

So you sort of agree you just don't call it a bridge. That's the same as someone like myself using the term belting instead of edge.  Just different terms.  Can we please be friends again

Last edited by Danielformica (2014-12-02 18:16:29)


DANIEL
WWW.YOURVOCALTEACHER.COM
WWW.DANIELFORMICAVOCALSTUDIO.COM
www.soundcloud.com/daniel-formica

Disclaimer-Anything I write or try to help people with on here are techniques and things that have worked for ME.  They are not necessarily" right" or "wrong" but have worked for ME and my 20+ yrs as a professional working
singer.
Thank you

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#117 2014-12-02 18:26:25

Martin H
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Registered: 2008-11-25
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Daniel

No I don't agree. Just because I acknowledge that some singers have trouble-areas, that doesn't mean that I agree that there are specific areas (ex. your "bridges") where you have "to do something". Especially not at "almost fixed" intervals like C4, E4, Bb4 and C5.

Those intervals don't make sense (where do they come from?). That's why I ask: What specifically happens at those points and why do you have "to do something"? But no one has answered yet.

Last edited by Martin H (2014-12-02 18:49:31)

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#118 2014-12-02 18:49:42

Danielformica
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From: San Luis Obispo
Registered: 2011-08-10
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin you said it yourself and you demonstrated it(intensity differs on your demonstrations)You "did something at a specific area". You don't have to do anything you are right about that but in my opinion to keep the voice optimal and balanced a student should learn to negotiate the bridges or areas of the voice so there is not an "acoustic overload" and then choose what he wants to do for his or her sound ideal. I don't know the specifics other than when I take myself through scales and work on my own voice slowly I feel at certain areas "i should lower my intensity hear or modify the vowel here or i won't quite keep a acoustical balance. And I was taught that by a few different coaches. Just like you were taught things by your coaches and the way they explained it worked for you


DANIEL
WWW.YOURVOCALTEACHER.COM
WWW.DANIELFORMICAVOCALSTUDIO.COM
www.soundcloud.com/daniel-formica

Disclaimer-Anything I write or try to help people with on here are techniques and things that have worked for ME.  They are not necessarily" right" or "wrong" but have worked for ME and my 20+ yrs as a professional working
singer.
Thank you

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#119 2014-12-02 18:57:15

Martin H
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Daniel

Again, you don't address those specific points ("bridges") and why people have to "do something"?

Why do singers have to deal with the following areas:  C4, E4, Bb4 and C5??

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#120 2014-12-02 19:00:58

Danielformica
TMV Forum Member
From: San Luis Obispo
Registered: 2011-08-10
Posts: 1552
Reputation :   62 
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin H wrote:

@Owen

I don't use the normal concept of "bridging". I acknowledge that there are certain places in ones range that can be difficult to navigate. Also, the progressive narrowing of the vowels has nothing to do with the narrowing that happens at the lower pharyngeal levels in regards to higher pitches.

I don't see why you have to alter the vowel at those specific places that you and others talk about? Actually, you can bridge on every single note just by changing the vowel (formant shift) if you like. Just say the word "hey" and you have made a formant shift on the same note. And I understand that's not what you guys mean about bridging?

A lot of people talk about the main passaggio and that you have to bridge that area (Eb4-G4). However, you don't have to do anything in that area unless you want to - hence you don't have to change the vowel.

Martin said "I don't see any problems in using the "ah" vowel throughout the range without modifying? The only thing to be aware of is not using too much volume. So I still don't understand why you and others mention those specific "bridging" areas?"

martin said "I just want to note, that in my opinion, the need for vowel modifications is not depended on specific areas in the voice ("bridges") - but instead it's highly depended on intensity. "

these are places where you didn't call it a BRIDGE but you are saying "something needs to be done "  i call that SOMETHING  a BRIDGE.. that is all...


DANIEL
WWW.YOURVOCALTEACHER.COM
WWW.DANIELFORMICAVOCALSTUDIO.COM
www.soundcloud.com/daniel-formica

Disclaimer-Anything I write or try to help people with on here are techniques and things that have worked for ME.  They are not necessarily" right" or "wrong" but have worked for ME and my 20+ yrs as a professional working
singer.
Thank you

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#121 2014-12-02 19:03:56

VIDEOHERE
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

i have to mainly agree with martin on a lot of this subject.  you can just sing and pass right over those bridges...you could have been taught that nothing has to be done in these areas but do things like cry through them or narrow through them while bringing in height.

the more you think of them as there, i believe the more tripped up you can get.

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#122 2014-12-02 19:05:20

Danielformica
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From: San Luis Obispo
Registered: 2011-08-10
Posts: 1552
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin H wrote:

@Daniel

Again, you don't address those specific points ("bridges") and why people have to "do something"?

Why do singers have to deal with the following areas:  C4, E4, Bb4 and C5??

I address it in the fact that a feel it when I'm vocalizing and my students do as well. I would tell them its like stuffing a certain frequency where it doesn't want to be so drop the intensity modify the vowel etc and it will set the frequency straight instead of bullying the frequency.. its an easy way to explain it as I barely made it out of high school.  You are study speech pathology i believe you get all book smart and tell me the specifics...


DANIEL
WWW.YOURVOCALTEACHER.COM
WWW.DANIELFORMICAVOCALSTUDIO.COM
www.soundcloud.com/daniel-formica

Disclaimer-Anything I write or try to help people with on here are techniques and things that have worked for ME.  They are not necessarily" right" or "wrong" but have worked for ME and my 20+ yrs as a professional working
singer.
Thank you

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#123 2014-12-02 19:06:36

Danielformica
TMV Forum Member
From: San Luis Obispo
Registered: 2011-08-10
Posts: 1552
Reputation :   62 
Website

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

VIDEOHERE wrote:

i have to mainly agree with martin on a lot of this subject.  you can just sing and pass right over those bridges...you could have been taught that nothing has to be done in these areas but do things like cry through them or narrow through them while bringing in height.

the more you think of them as there, i believe the more tripped up you can get.

Right bob but crying and narrowing them is helping you go through the bridge...get it you are doing something to get through there


DANIEL
WWW.YOURVOCALTEACHER.COM
WWW.DANIELFORMICAVOCALSTUDIO.COM
www.soundcloud.com/daniel-formica

Disclaimer-Anything I write or try to help people with on here are techniques and things that have worked for ME.  They are not necessarily" right" or "wrong" but have worked for ME and my 20+ yrs as a professional working
singer.
Thank you

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#124 2014-12-02 19:07:23

Martin H
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Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Daniel

What have intensity and something needs "to be done" to do with your "bridges" (C4, E4, Bb4 and C5)?

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#125 2014-12-02 19:13:18

Danielformica
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From: San Luis Obispo
Registered: 2011-08-10
Posts: 1552
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

well not "needs".. you can stay the same on certain vowels  and you can stay the same on vowels and end up strained but changing the intensity is "doing something" that is all


DANIEL
WWW.YOURVOCALTEACHER.COM
WWW.DANIELFORMICAVOCALSTUDIO.COM
www.soundcloud.com/daniel-formica

Disclaimer-Anything I write or try to help people with on here are techniques and things that have worked for ME.  They are not necessarily" right" or "wrong" but have worked for ME and my 20+ yrs as a professional working
singer.
Thank you

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#126 2014-12-02 19:19:33

Martin H
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Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Daniel

But how do the areas (C4, E4, Bb4 and C5) relate to intensity? Why those areas?

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#127 2014-12-02 19:23:47

Robert Lunte
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From: Earth
Registered: 2008-11-08
Posts: 3087
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin H wrote:

@Daniel

But how do the areas (C4, E4, Bb4 and C5) relate to intensity? Why those areas?

Because the resonant energy inside the format at those positions, will be overloaded if you don't make modifications for them, provided that you want a singer friendly transition. The amplified harmonics at those positions need to be realigned to the changing formant.

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#128 2014-12-02 19:28:57

Danielformica
TMV Forum Member
From: San Luis Obispo
Registered: 2011-08-10
Posts: 1552
Reputation :   62 
Website

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

i said earlier you call it acoustic overload ,fine done. i was taught a different word or term that is all


DANIEL
WWW.YOURVOCALTEACHER.COM
WWW.DANIELFORMICAVOCALSTUDIO.COM
www.soundcloud.com/daniel-formica

Disclaimer-Anything I write or try to help people with on here are techniques and things that have worked for ME.  They are not necessarily" right" or "wrong" but have worked for ME and my 20+ yrs as a professional working
singer.
Thank you

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#129 2014-12-02 19:33:52

Martin H
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
Reputation :   31 

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Daniel

Well, scientists call it that (overload). But it seems you haven't got an answer to your own disposition about the bridges at  C4, E4, Bb4 and C5.

Last edited by Martin H (2014-12-02 19:35:37)

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#130 2014-12-02 19:37:54

FelipeCarvalho
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From: Brasil
Registered: 2011-07-28
Posts: 2889
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Website

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin H wrote:

FelipeCarvalho wrote:

Would you say its important that the singer learns how it feels like when doing so?

If you consider that males often go above the intensity that would allow the use of all possible vowels, its not that hard to understand why mapping changes of sensations and some "default" modifications can be useful.

I definitely agree that it's important that the singer learns to be aware of the differences. And vowel modifications are very important.

I just want to note, that in my opinion, the need for vowel modifications is not depended on specific areas in the voice ("bridges") - but instead it's highly depended on intensity.

Two quick examples in regards to the passaggio:

-You can sing an "ee" from Eb4-G4 without modifying if you keep the volume low/medium

-You can sing an "ih" from Eb4-G4 without modifying if you keep the volume medium/loud

Hum yes Martin, they are not dependant until specific needs regarding languages and styles appear. Which in my opinion can not be disregarded as optional, its part of the deal...

If you are singing a lullaby its one thing, if you are singing heavy metal, another...  I believe the training needs to allow handling what comes along in terms of dynamics.


These "bridges" on regular intervals are a result of keeping the intensity the same from low to high as far as I understand it, if you just continue ascending closure levels will decrease or you will go louder. I dont find it a particularly useful info. I do find the middle one at E4 and F4 quite useful for other reasons, nothing physiological though.

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#131 2014-12-02 19:39:20

Martin H
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Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Robert Lunte wrote:

Because the resonant energy inside the format at those positions, will be overloaded if you don't make modifications for them, provided that you want a singer friendly transition. The amplified harmonics at those positions need to be realigned to the changing formant.

But that's not the case Robert. You can sing an "ee" from Eb4-G4 without 5 harmonics (H1-H5) even crossing a formant!

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#132 2014-12-02 19:47:41

Martin H
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
Reputation :   31 

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

FelipeCarvalho wrote:

Hum yes Martin, they are not dependant until specific needs regarding languages and styles appear. Which in my opinion can not be disregarded as optional, its part of the deal...

If you are singing a lullaby its one thing, if you are singing heavy metal, another...  I believe the training needs to allow handling what comes along in terms of dynamics.


These "bridges" on regular intervals are a result of keeping the intensity the same from low to high as far as I understand it, if you just continue ascending closure levels will decrease or you will go louder. I dont find it a particularly useful info. I do find the middle one at E4 and F4 quite useful for other reasons, nothing physiological though.

Sure Felipe, in regards to certain styles, some changes have to happen to be within the sound ideal.

In regards to intensity, you don't have to use the same amount of adduction/closure. But still, that has nothing to do with the specific "bridges".

Last edited by Martin H (2014-12-02 19:49:56)

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#133 2014-12-02 20:01:34

Robert Lunte
TMV World Forum - Founder
From: Earth
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Posts: 3087
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Wow, tough audience here... lol... seems Martin has us "over a barrel"... Ok, I give up!  Uncle... what are you hitting at ol' friend?

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#134 2014-12-02 20:05:26

Martin H
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Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Robert

LOL, well it's quite simple. I stated earlier in this thread (#100):

I guess what I'm trying to clarify is where "bridging" is a necessity and not simply a preference?

Last edited by Martin H (2014-12-02 20:06:18)

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#135 2014-12-02 20:22:14

Danielformica
TMV Forum Member
From: San Luis Obispo
Registered: 2011-08-10
Posts: 1552
Reputation :   62 
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

im not a scientist i just go by what i feel and was taught by Seth and it works. you can get all scientifickky and i will learn that from you. Ill teach with the terms i like to use and you do what you like.

and i stated you can sing anyway you want you are right about that. you can put a square peg in a round holeit doesnt make it correct maybe correct for the style..


DANIEL
WWW.YOURVOCALTEACHER.COM
WWW.DANIELFORMICAVOCALSTUDIO.COM
www.soundcloud.com/daniel-formica

Disclaimer-Anything I write or try to help people with on here are techniques and things that have worked for ME.  They are not necessarily" right" or "wrong" but have worked for ME and my 20+ yrs as a professional working
singer.
Thank you

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#136 2014-12-02 20:38:27

Martin H
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Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Daniel

I understand. So those "bridges" are just something based on what you feel and was apparently taught by Seth?

Last edited by Martin H (2014-12-02 20:39:44)

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#137 2014-12-02 20:51:18

Jens
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Registered: 2009-01-07
Posts: 1461
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

guys when ive got you all here gathered perhaps you could explain to me the diffrence between headvoice and falsetto? ;)

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#138 2014-12-02 20:56:16

Martin H
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@jens

A bit off thread. But what are your definitions of those two terms?

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#139 2014-12-02 20:57:15

Danielformica
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From: San Luis Obispo
Registered: 2011-08-10
Posts: 1552
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Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin H wrote:

@Daniel

I understand. So those "bridges" are just something based on what you feel and was apparently taught by Seth?

right and you call them acoustic overload.. cool:cool: John Henny did a great tutorial on "the Science of vocal bridges" so he explains with a bigger brain than mine(you like science you should get it then you will know where im coming from) Bridges exist they are there they are not not imaginary.. I know you are mocking me in your last sentence and thats fine im not very book smart but I am a good singer and teacher who understands the voice very well.


jens he took the bait?  hahaha

Last edited by Danielformica (2014-12-02 20:59:03)


DANIEL
WWW.YOURVOCALTEACHER.COM
WWW.DANIELFORMICAVOCALSTUDIO.COM
www.soundcloud.com/daniel-formica

Disclaimer-Anything I write or try to help people with on here are techniques and things that have worked for ME.  They are not necessarily" right" or "wrong" but have worked for ME and my 20+ yrs as a professional working
singer.
Thank you

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#140 2014-12-02 21:06:49

Martin H
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Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
Reputation :   31 

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Daniel

I'm NOT mocking you. I just want an answer to a question that I proposed you. But you haven't answered it yet! Let me remind:

But how do the areas (C4, E4, Bb4 and C5) relate to intensity? Why those areas?

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#141 2014-12-02 21:14:33

Danielformica
TMV Forum Member
From: San Luis Obispo
Registered: 2011-08-10
Posts: 1552
Reputation :   62 
Website

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

I told you and you told me   ITS SCIENCE.. I dont have to know the scientific behind it to teach it. ITS singing not science. you go ahead and tell us and then we will know scientifically but will you be able to understand it. my daughter is 17 doing AP physics in highschool.  She explains things to me all the time however I dont understand it. but i do feel the ares in question and know that if i change the vowel or intensity something nice happens to my voice and when i teach it I make sure they feel it as well. and when they want the science to it (very rare) i tell them to purchase John Hennys tutorial THE SCIENCE OF VOCAL BRIDGES..


DANIEL
WWW.YOURVOCALTEACHER.COM
WWW.DANIELFORMICAVOCALSTUDIO.COM
www.soundcloud.com/daniel-formica

Disclaimer-Anything I write or try to help people with on here are techniques and things that have worked for ME.  They are not necessarily" right" or "wrong" but have worked for ME and my 20+ yrs as a professional working
singer.
Thank you

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#142 2014-12-02 21:15:57

Martin H
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
Reputation :   31 

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Danielformica wrote:

jens he took the bait?  hahaha

Is this a game to you?

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#143 2014-12-02 21:21:52

Danielformica
TMV Forum Member
From: San Luis Obispo
Registered: 2011-08-10
Posts: 1552
Reputation :   62 
Website

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

that was yeah? why are you so serious? i like to joke to lighten things..


DANIEL
WWW.YOURVOCALTEACHER.COM
WWW.DANIELFORMICAVOCALSTUDIO.COM
www.soundcloud.com/daniel-formica

Disclaimer-Anything I write or try to help people with on here are techniques and things that have worked for ME.  They are not necessarily" right" or "wrong" but have worked for ME and my 20+ yrs as a professional working
singer.
Thank you

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#144 2014-12-02 21:22:03

MDEW
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2012-06-24
Posts: 2866
Reputation :   32 

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Is this question just for Dan or can anyone play? :|   When thinking about it it does nos not make any sense. You Should be able to continue with the same Closure,Volume,Vowel between F#4 and G4 but it does not happen without some kind of shift. Even the most advanced singers when caught off guard will have problems at that particular area. There is science that explains it.


"Knock me down, It's all in vain. I'll get right back on my feet again."  Pat Benatar

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#145 2014-12-02 21:27:22

Martin H
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
Reputation :   31 

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@MDEW

Here's my take on it. Where's the "shift"?:

https://app.box.com/s/v2ui7p76qimnzukvgszy

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#146 2014-12-02 21:31:56

Jens
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2009-01-07
Posts: 1461
Reputation :   36 

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin H wrote:

@jens

A bit off thread. But what are your definitions of those two terms?

It's just a joke;) it 's been debate like once a week Since this forum started.

However i think this turns into nitpicking and focusing way to much on terminology.

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#147 2014-12-02 21:35:10

Robert Lunte
TMV World Forum - Founder
From: Earth
Registered: 2008-11-08
Posts: 3087
Reputation :   55 
Website

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Jens... the difference between falsetto and head voice is , head voice is when you hit a high note in your falsetto?

:D

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#148 2014-12-02 21:35:19

Martin H
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2008-11-25
Posts: 1186
Reputation :   31 

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

@Jens

What has been debated once a week?

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#149 2014-12-02 21:38:55

MDEW
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2012-06-24
Posts: 2866
Reputation :   32 

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Martin H wrote:

@MDEW

Here's my take on it. Where's the "shift"?:

https://app.box.com/s/v2ui7p76qimnzukvgszy

I didn't hear it or feel it...... Then again, I wasn't singing it.
   I understand that it is like the earlier shift(Passage) C4 D4. I can now sing beyond that up the G4 without "Feeling" or sounding as if I have changed something But after singing John Prine...and then Singing Heartbreak Hotel wich starts on the E4 I realise that there is a "Shift" I have to make.
   Those "Shifts" or Changes in resonance, volume vowel become incremental after a while.
For me the G4 is something I am still working on.

Last edited by MDEW (2014-12-02 21:39:36)


"Knock me down, It's all in vain. I'll get right back on my feet again."  Pat Benatar

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#150 2014-12-02 21:42:17

Clint Torres
TMV Forum Member
From: Where the sun don't shine
Registered: 2014-10-03
Posts: 83
Reputation :   

Re: Should I buy the KTVA videos?

Danielformica wrote:

im not a scientist i just go by what i feel and was taught by Seth and it works. you can get all scientifickky and i will learn that from you. Ill teach with the terms i like to use and you do what you like.

and i stated you can sing anyway you want you are right about that. you can put a square peg in a round holeit doesnt make it correct maybe correct for the style..

No way I'm getting involved in this. It's all Greek to me :D   But this statement does resonate with me to an extant. I have learned many things in my life from sports to diet to exercise and everything in between. Much of it I have researched and read studies and the science to back it. I have collected data in an effort to make an informed decision on how I would like to proceed and what I believe works. Then I learn how to do it. Then, over time, I forget the science and the reasoning and the how to's and why's. All I remember is how I do it and that there is science behind it. I know this because I know I studied and researched it. What I studied and researched is long gone from my brain, but to me it doesn't matter. I know I can do it and I know that somewhere there is science and physics to back it. At that point I no longer care about that. All I care about is doing it.

Thanks Dan. :)

Last edited by Clint Torres (2014-12-02 21:43:08)

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