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#1 2012-05-20 17:13:06

onprcntr
TMV Forum Member
From: Illinois
Registered: 2012-03-03
Posts: 60
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Need a mic with a tighter pattern

I need some guidance on a new mic. I currently us an sm58 and I love it except with high stage volume it picks up the guitars and bass. It's so bad that it distorts my IEM's and totally sucks.


...With your bitchslap rappin' and your cocaine tongue, you get nothin' done...

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2012-05-20 17:13:06

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#2 2012-05-20 18:18:58

Robert Lunte
TMV World Forum - Founder
From: Earth
Registered: 2008-11-08
Posts: 3087
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Re: Need a mic with a tighter pattern

The SM58 sucks, no offense... well honestly, its a good mic, but there are so many other microphones available on the market that are better then the tired old, SM58... that was designed in 1958, which is why it is called the SM58... and the older ones were made in the US.. the newer ones are not as good, they are made in China with cheap parts.

Too many people are sold on the SM58 because its become an icon and its what most Guitar Center guys sell you, out of habit. They don't really dig into your application, they don't invite you to demo different microphones to see which one sounds good to your voice, they don't discuss ergonomics to insure it feels good in your hand (a very important detail that some microphone companies are paying attention to), and etc...

Here is a blog I created that has an updated list of great microphones. I own and regularly use all of these mics and they are all great, some are excellent, (especially the German mics, that stand in a  class of their own. Nobody makes cars like the Germans and nobody makes microphones like the Germans, its really true...), all... are better then the SM58. So my advise would be, lose the retched SM58 and move on to a microphone that you choose for you... not that the industry or marketing chose for you because its convenient and they don't really know any better.

One final note, if you want a direct replacement of the SM58, but better.. you can't beat the RODE M1. Its great for durability and has very high tolerance for feedback. If you want to go fancy pants and blow your mind, get the Sennheiser e935.  If you want a mic that sounds like an expensive mic, but is incredibly a good value... the Electro Voice 767a is the best value on the market.

In the live condenser microphone arena, the best live condenser mic is the RODE M2... Ive tested many of them.

http://themodernvocalistworld.com/2010/ … -vocalist/

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#3 2012-05-20 20:13:29

onprcntr
TMV Forum Member
From: Illinois
Registered: 2012-03-03
Posts: 60
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Website

Re: Need a mic with a tighter pattern

I bought the sm58 because it's what I am used to. (every sound engineer I have ever worked with uses them) I used the EV for a while but it was worse for picking up unwanted sounds and started crapping out on me. What I would really like is something that sounds like a Beta58 and picks up minimal background noise. Thanks for the link I am checking it out now.


...With your bitchslap rappin' and your cocaine tongue, you get nothin' done...

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#4 2012-05-20 23:09:58

AntonioTP
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2011-09-08
Posts: 7
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Re: Need a mic with a tighter pattern

Greetings.

About mics (good ones) picking unwanted sounds, isn't that the job of the sound engineers to take care of?

Robert, regardless of their price, what do you think about the Shure KSM 9 and the Neumann KMS 105?

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#5 2012-05-21 04:56:36

TimmyP1955
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Registered: 2010-12-03
Posts: 58
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Re: Need a mic with a tighter pattern

Audix OM7, EV 767a, 967a or PL80a (hearsay on the last two).  I usually use the OM7s, but I use the 767a when I think a little looser pattern (but still much tighter than a 58) might be useful).

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#6 2012-05-21 14:56:02

onprcntr
TMV Forum Member
From: Illinois
Registered: 2012-03-03
Posts: 60
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Re: Need a mic with a tighter pattern

We don't have a sound engineer. Even if we don't run our own most "sound engineers" are a joke. It is hard to find someone very good without paying them every dime we make from a gig. I was looking at the OM7 and the OM11 yesterday but I still haven't pulled the trigger on anything. It's only an issue because our guitar player won't turn his damn amp down. The stage volume was so loud we could not hear the drums. We need to have an intervention.


...With your bitchslap rappin' and your cocaine tongue, you get nothin' done...

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#7 2012-05-21 15:46:15

stew503
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2011-04-09
Posts: 158
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Re: Need a mic with a tighter pattern

Hi,

By Guitarist amp do you mean stage monitor (as you all plug to mixer), or are you seperate amps and spend time mixing and matching.  Or does the guitarist have the stack at back one side or other, or do you have the desk setup.

The reason I ask is that that's quite a lot of Db's for the Mic to be collecting.  If it was so bad - it'll be feeding back rather than distortion on the IEM (as well as the cabs). ... That or the compressors gone for the chop (or threshold wrong / too high - I know this because my compressor's def gone to the compressor in the sky and cr""ping out).

If it's the IEM distorting, then the desk sends to the IEM are wrong, unless ... again it's from the guitarists and bass monitors into the Mic, then get them re-angled at 120 to 150 degrees and it's some serious Db's again for them to affect (what -15 at 120 the back of the 58).

Can you explain the setup ? inc desk sends (i.e. do you indivually send or mix send to IEM) as 58's have been out there in ubiquitous situations. ... and yes I agree some FOH are not worth the penny.

Also is this a recent thing since the guitarist turned up the volume ?, i.e. turn him/her down !!


Robert - Have you ever compared the E935 against the E845 as I find the 845 too bright on the ladies.

Last edited by stew503 (2012-05-21 16:00:11)

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#8 2012-06-01 05:26:49

TimmyP1955
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2010-12-03
Posts: 58
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Re: Need a mic with a tighter pattern

If you are hearing distortion in your IEMs, it's because something is being operated incorrectly - a gain structure problem - at some point in the chain, something is being run too hot, and something downstream from that is turned down to compensate.

Or your earbuds are so inefficient that your pack cannot drive them loud enough without distorting.

Or the buds are crap and they are distorting.


But it's not because the guitar is too loud.  (It likely IS too loud, but that's a different problem.)

Last edited by TimmyP1955 (2012-07-21 08:13:10)

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#9 2012-06-10 01:00:21

onprcntr
TMV Forum Member
From: Illinois
Registered: 2012-03-03
Posts: 60
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Website

Re: Need a mic with a tighter pattern

Its the 120 watt Rivera half stack behind my left shoulder. It doesn't happen in a larger room. I realize why it's distorting but if I turn it down I can't hear. I guess what I'm saying is I'm aware it is because the IEM's are overdriven my point is that cranking my IEM is not pleasing to the ear. In small rooms I have to take his amp almost completely out of the mix to balance the sound, because it is so damn loud. It sounds really good and he wails but you can't convince him it will sound as good turned down a little. We are the loudest band I know because of him!


...With your bitchslap rappin' and your cocaine tongue, you get nothin' done...

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#10 2012-06-11 05:08:03

TimmyP1955
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2010-12-03
Posts: 58
Reputation :   

Re: Need a mic with a tighter pattern

Perhaps you have a lot of lower register guitar leakage into your ears, and to get any definition you have to crank it.  Two things to try:

Pull a lot of lows (and maybe low mids) out of the guitar channel.  The thin sound from the IEMs will blend with the leakage into your ears, and give you a normal tone at a much more reasonable volume.

Reverse the polarity of the guitar channel.  The lows in your IEMs and the leakage into your ears will hopefully cancel in part, so you will have less mud and won't have to crank the guitar so much in your IEMs.

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#11 2012-07-04 07:42:48

JohnRaimondo
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2012-07-04
Posts: 1
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Re: Need a mic with a tighter pattern

Can anyone suggest me the best Guitar? I wanna purchase an extravagant Guitar for my upcoming event.

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#12 2012-07-04 22:00:00

ronws
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2010-05-23
Posts: 11731
Reputation :   139 

Re: Need a mic with a tighter pattern

John, this is a singer's forum, not a guitar forum, though a number of us here do play guitar, myself included. If you don't know what you want, I would say go with Gibson, good for all around playing. Either Gibson or a copy. I have 3 guitars. A Memphis Les Paul copy I bought in 1982. A Hondo Flying V copy I bought in 1990. And I used to have a cheapie acoustic that I bought at a flea market. I broke a brace in it, still have it, just don't play it. The acoustic I now have is a Spectrum cut-away with built-in pick-ups and on-board volume and eq. Got it for 60 bucks at a pawn shop.

Unless, of course, you just keyed in on the word guitar and your post has nothing to do with microphones from a singer's standpoint. That's always possible.

A little more on topic. I've had good experience at Guitar Center. I went in there looking for a Rode M-1. They carry it on the website but not in the stores. You have to order it. Anyway, I was talking with a salesman and told him of my plight. I have a light tenor voice with a LOT of volume up top. He pointed me to the Sennheiser e835, which he sells like crazy to singers in our area (I was shopping at the one in Plano, Texas, though I don't live in Plano. I did not buy it there. I found a brand new one on ebay. Bid one dollar over minimum bid. No one took the bait, so I got it for their original list price, $74.99, no shipping fees. Approximately half of retail. Delivery took two days.

I think the salesman led me to the right mic for me, even though I didn't buy it there. But others' milage may vary.


"When the daylight is rising up in my eyes ..." - Klaus Meine

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#13 2012-07-21 08:14:46

TimmyP1955
TMV Forum Member
Registered: 2010-12-03
Posts: 58
Reputation :   

Re: Need a mic with a tighter pattern

Guitar? ravenwestguitars.com  Astounding quality for the money.

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