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  •  » How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

#1 2011-05-26 03:46:51

JoshJ25
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Registered: 2009-08-19
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How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

After exercising, I find that my throat hurts, not majorly but its maybe a sore type of feeling. Not really sure. After a good 30 minute vocal exercise routine, what are  healthy feelings and symptoms and what are some DEFINITE bad feelings. Can anyone define clearly whats the difference between the feeling of strain and the feeling of a good workout?

Is the voice and throat supposed to feel kind of tender and worn out after exercising it?

Thanks for the replies!

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#2 2011-05-26 03:57:31

NCdan
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Registered: 2011-01-06
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Re: How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

I may or may not know what I"m talking about, but if your throat is physically sore, I'd say that is bad technique.  If I'm trying to extend my range and singing high, my voice will literally just die after not taking a break for so long, but give it a couple of hours and it's ready to go again, no pain or anything.  I think that is similar to wrist and ankle fatigue when playing fast on drums.  There is a difference between "good workout" sore and "ouch that hurts" sore.

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#3 2011-05-26 04:52:26

Spectrum
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From: Aussieland
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Re: How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

If it hurts, you are doing it wrong. End of story. There is no such thing as "good workout sore." Your throat hurts because your vocal cords are swollen.


I'm not a teacher. Please take my posts as mere suggestions.

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#4 2011-05-26 07:15:54

Robert Lunte
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Re: How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

When you go to the gym and have great work out, do you feel pain afterwards or do you just feel muscles worked out?  Perhaps a bit fatigued, but not pain, would you agree? 

If you feel pain, its wrong.  If you feel worked, maybe a little tired for an evening, but are totally back in shape the next day with complete strength and dexterity restored, your fine.  The voice is a muscle and you have to work it out. 

Feelings of cramping, choking, tight muscles are wrong... tired muscles are fine if not, great.... It means you have been working out or singing strong, getting stronger.  Ultimately, if your bridging to the head voice your fine.  Once phonations are in the head voice, a singer can honestly give it hell and its very difficult to hurt yourself. Its only when locked into the limited confines of the chest voice that constrictor muscles get involved and singing that would otherwise float and flutter in a heady placement, will quickly be dispatched for primitive shouting.

As long as your bridging smoothly and are phonating in your head voice above E4 for men, you can work it out assertively and you'll be better for it.  The key to your freedom in singing, is not to stop contracting muscles, its learning how to contract the right ones inside the head voice and isolate away from the chest where belting quickly runs out of rope and becomes shouting.

Hope this helps...

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#5 2011-05-26 17:11:37

VIDEOHERE
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Registered: 2008-12-22
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Re: How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

JoshJ25 wrote:

After exercising, I find that my throat hurts, not majorly but its maybe a sore type of feeling. Not really sure. After a good 30 minute vocal exercise routine, what are  healthy feelings and symptoms and what are some DEFINITE bad feelings. Can anyone define clearly whats the difference between the feeling of strain and the feeling of a good workout?

Is the voice and throat supposed to feel kind of tender and worn out after exercising it?

Thanks for the replies!

you can get a "little" sore yes, but it also depends on the exercise. i know for me, when i do those "gug" and goog" exercises and concentrate on keeping the larynx down you will get a "good worked-out" feeling. also if your doing some of those advanced quick breathing diaphram "ha" "ha" "ha" exercises, you might feel a workout equivalent to having done a few crunches. i'm a firm believer in that when you're finished exercising, (particulary full voice exercises, or compression exercises) you can tell you've worked at it.

now if the actual throat itself is sore, then i'd be concerned, because the throat should be totally passive and uninvolved in exercises.
i.m.h. opinion, you shouldn't even know your throat exists.

Last edited by VIDEOHERE (2011-05-26 23:40:52)

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#6 2011-05-26 21:14:55

geno
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Registered: 2009-10-30
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Re: How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

This is a tough one.  I've injured my voice a few times requiring weeks / months to recover.  You have to know the difference between a good hurt and a bad hurt and that is very difficult to explain.  I now know this difference.  The muscles in your larynx are very small and easy to pull.  It may not even hurt that much.  It's not like lifting weights when you kill yourself trying to pick up heavier weights, and then everything is fine the next day and you never do any damage to your biceps or whatever.

I can tell you that if you practice a daily regimine that is consistent from day to day, and know when to quit you should be fine.  When extending your range, be very careful.  You can go up to your highest note, and then try for a 1/2 step higher ONCE that day.  Do not try to push the range extension.  It will come next day or in the next few days.  But your voice needs time (sleep) to rebuild and strengthen.

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#7 2011-05-27 00:10:51

Ronron
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Registered: 2010-08-29
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Re: How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

Ultimately, if your bridging to the head voice your fine.  Once phonations are in the head voice, a singer can honestly give it hell and its very difficult to hurt yourself. Its only when locked into the limited confines of the chest voice that constrictor muscles get involved and singing that would otherwise float and flutter in a heady placement, will quickly be dispatched for primitive shouting.

I'm finding this more and more true everyday :D


Why aren't days 32 hours long ? <_<

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#8 2011-05-27 02:14:22

JoshJ25
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Registered: 2009-08-19
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Re: How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

Thanks Rob, VIDEOHERE and guitartrek

To clarify, I dont mean pain per-se, but more like a mild soreness where at the end of my routine (30 minutes or so) some of my lower notes are flatter and shakier than before the session. But I am usually fine within a few hours afterwards.

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#9 2011-05-27 02:16:57

JoshJ25
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Re: How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

guitartrek wrote:

When extending your range, be very careful.  You can go up to your highest note, and then try for a 1/2 step higher ONCE that day.  Do not try to push the range extension.  It will come next day or in the next few days.  But your voice needs time (sleep) to rebuild and strengthen.

I think this is where my problem lies, I try a bit too hard on the lows and highs to squeeze out one extra note and Im probably straining somewhat on those. I have to keep things smooth and relaxed.

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#10 2011-05-27 02:21:07

ronws
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Registered: 2010-05-23
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Re: How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

30 minutes should not lead to soreness or even a "slightly worn" feeling. You should be able to sing for an hour or more and still feel like you could do more. So, you are doing something wrong.


"I've been to the edge. You know, I stood and looked down" - David Lee Roth

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#11 2011-05-27 16:12:54

NCdan
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Registered: 2011-01-06
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Re: How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

It may be overexertion.  There are some songs that are too high for me that will pretty much end a session whether I do them right away or after I'm warmed up.

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#12 2011-05-27 16:58:48

VIDEOHERE
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Registered: 2008-12-22
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Re: How to judge the difference between vocal fatigue & vocal strain/pain?

JoshJ25 wrote:

guitartrek wrote:

When extending your range, be very careful.  You can go up to your highest note, and then try for a 1/2 step higher ONCE that day.  Do not try to push the range extension.  It will come next day or in the next few days.  But your voice needs time (sleep) to rebuild and strengthen.

I think this is where my problem lies, I try a bit too hard on the lows and highs to squeeze out one extra note and Im probably straining somewhat on those. I have to keep things smooth and relaxed.

yes, but you still have to work at it. it's so difficult to explain, without being there.

although you may be smooth and relaxed in the neck, throat, and jaw, (that's great) but there are some exercises i do, for example lugo's got this tongue out arpeggio where the vocal folds feel like they are lighty kissing way up high and i'm supporting strongly and holding back air and really working (not straining), but working just to make them adduct lightly way up with your tongue out. it's easy to default into falsetto up there or to relax up there, but you grow the higher end by avoiding this and trying each day to get more and more connection. then you've got the vowel mods. and all that coordination to work on..it takes work.

i go to a point where the next note is unconnected and stop then on the way down the same thing...there's always tomorrow.

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